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  1. #1
    Forum Ambassador VAB2013's Avatar
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    1985P Unlisted SKH with pre-cud at lower vest

    Additional Information
    Date: 1985P

    Not sure if pre-cud is the correct term or not so please let me know. This spike head cent looks LMDS to me and the devices are mushy. The spike starts out light, almost like a PSD scratch so if it didn't continue going into the hair and developing chips, I might have missed it. And missed what looks like the starting of a cud at the lower vest.

    Could not do a collage on this one because it was taking away too much detail when the photos were downsized.

    Here we go! Thank you for looking and giving help!
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Paid Member Petespockets55's Avatar
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    I believe these are just die cracks with a die chip.
    They make great markers when around VDB of course.

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    Forum Ambassador VAB2013's Avatar
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    Thank you Cliff! Well, I did some more digging around and I found some info about pre-cuds on error-ref.com, so that's probably where I saw it before and couldn't remember.

    Then I looked at cuds-on-coins to see if a cud showed up in this location... #19 looks pretty close to me, what do you think?

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    Paid Member makecents's Avatar
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    I would say you are on the right path Viv, but like with BIE's, you would almost have to do a study with coin in hand to verify that it was the same die and so on. I could see how what you have could eventually become a CUD though. Very cool looking!!

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    Forum Ambassador VAB2013's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by makecents View Post
    I would say you are on the right path Viv, but like with BIE's, you would almost have to do a study with coin in hand to verify that it was the same die and so on. I could see how what you have could eventually become a CUD though. Very cool looking!!
    Thank you Jon for taking a look! Yeah.. I curiously looked to see if the listing had any markers, but there were not any. I guess when you haven't found a big cud yet... a pre-cud will just have to do

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    Paid Member jfines69's Avatar
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    Nice find Vivien... I didn't see a listing for the spike... I think your other crack is a retained cud??? Not sure tho as the way error ref http://www.error-ref.com/?s=pre+cud defines the Arcing Rim to Rim Die Crack (a.k.a. pre-cud) and the image of the 85P is a little confusing to me??? I can clearly see a shift at the 1st T of STATES... Most of the T is kicked NW and leaves a section of T on the east side of the crack??? There is also a small shift on the SW edge of the crack at the rim??? On your coin the east end of the crakc looks to have a small shift at the rim... West side of the crack looks slightly farther south than the east side??? The area at the east end of the jacket looks to be a chip and there may even be a crack along the jackets lip headed west??? As for being 019 on COC I do not think so... COCs 019 http://cuds-on-coins.com/lincoln-cent-cuds-1985/ does not appear to have the chip at the east end of the jacket that should be there with the cud being in place... In any case to me it is a new spike and either a new pre-cud or retained cud!!!
    Jim
    (A.K.A. Elmer Fudd) Be verwy verwy quiet... I'm hunting coins!!! Good Hunting!!!

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    Forum Ambassador VAB2013's Avatar
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    Thank you so much Jim for helping me with this! Sorry, it's given me some more questions??

    One thing I don't understand is how to tell shifting on the field of a coin where there are no devices present. I guess the die crack would have to have a substantial enough chip to consider shifting?

    "As for being 019 on COC I do not think so... COCs 019 http://cuds-on-coins.com/lincoln-cent-cuds-1985/ does not appear to have the chip at the east end of the jacket that should be there with the cud being in place"

    Can't tell on the COC 019 but I thought the chip on the east end of the jacket on my coin might be where the cud started and part of the cud?

    "there may even be a crack along the jackets lip headed west???"

    I don't understand this, where is the jackets lip?

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    Paid Member makecents's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VAB2013 View Post
    Thank you Jon for taking a look! Yeah.. I curiously looked to see if the listing had any markers, but there were not any. I guess when you haven't found a big cud yet... a pre-cud will just have to do
    I know what ya mean. I would be as excited about finding a large CUD as I would a major variety!! As Anthony would say, all in time....

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    Forum Ambassador VAB2013's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by makecents View Post
    I know what ya mean. I would be as excited about finding a large CUD as I would a major variety!! As Anthony would say, all in time....
    Yes, our day will come! Since I don't have as much time to search as I used to.... I'm only looking at years with known varieties, so there's a slim chance I will miss a cud when I'm going through the rolls, unless it's a big one!

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    Paid Member jfines69's Avatar
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    Where the crack connects to the rim at the east end- there is a difference between the east side of the crack and the west side at the rim - the east side sticks out farther, into the field than, the west side...
    The chip I was referring to on your coin is the one in the discolored area... Your chip looks like florida and just off its west end along the lip (top ridge) of the jacket there appears to be a crack going west???

    If you want I can download your pics and put some pointers on them... That may help a little better???
    Jim
    (A.K.A. Elmer Fudd) Be verwy verwy quiet... I'm hunting coins!!! Good Hunting!!!

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