PCGS

[pdi]

Bob, I’ve had the same questionable color designation on 2 Lincoln’s and 2 Indian head cents that came back unc details questionable color. Very frustrating. I’ve even resubmitted to no avail as of yet. Thinking through if I should try again. In regards to that designation, can anyone tell me if over time a questionable colored coin changes in some way due to whatever happened to or was used to enhance the coins appearance? Or does a true untreated coin behave differently over time as it ages.

[WaterSport]

Great questions. First let me say the "crack down" is deserved when you look at all the Blue shake and bake blue toned coins Mikes Mountain Values produces on eBay and ends up in NGC holders. With that being said, I think the powers at PCGS have changed the definition of questionable color but never bother to tell anyone. Typical PCGS. Now it looks like they are not grading coins with obvious album toning as if is "artificial" or something along those lines.

As far as copper turning in the holder - yes, it does happen. One of the reasons older holders for copper are sought is the idea that the copper has stabilized. But Years ago, PCGS gave up its guarantee on Copper changing in the holder. No doubt this was causing them money. Depending on how copper coins were stored in or around products varies plus the type of chemicals exposed to can all have different time frames for turning.

Bob

[pdi]

I’m not an expert in grading by any means Bob but the Indian I received was what I thought was a good source. An old bank roll from a bank in New York when Indians were removed from circulation. Here are two that I’m hoping over time show normal aging and not what happens to treated coins over time. I think they have an idea as to how coins naturally age and what unnatural mess with coins behave over time. Then I might get some sort of peace of mind one way or the other.

[WaterSport]

They look original skin to me. Here is one of mine.

[pdi]

That’s a nice looking coin Bob! I will probably keep trying every few years by resubmitting mine. Originally slabbed them in 15 then resubmitted in 19 and had them crack them out as raw. To no avail they came back with the same designation. I sure would like to know the criteria they use to evaluate coins they believe are tampered with or accidentally subjected to something that changes the natural progression.

[willbrooks]

That’s a nice looking coin Bob! I will probably keep trying every few years by resubmitting mine. Originally slabbed them in 15 then resubmitted in 19 and had them crack them out as raw. To no avail they came back with the same designation. I sure would like to know the criteria they use to evaluate coins they believe are tampered with or accidentally subjected to something that changes the natural progression.

For what it is worth, they were way harsher on me with my Indian submission compared to my Lincoln submission.

[willbrooks]

Great questions. First let me say the "crack down" is deserved when you look at all the Blue shake and bake blue toned coins Mikes Mountain Values produces on eBay and ends up in NGC holders. With that being said, I think the powers at PCGS have changed the definition of questionable color but never bother to tell anyone. Typical PCGS. Now it looks like they are not grading coins with obvious album toning as if is "artificial" or something along those lines.

As far as copper turning in the holder - yes, it does happen. One of the reasons older holders for copper are sought is the idea that the copper has stabilized. But Years ago, PCGS gave up its guarantee on Copper changing in the holder. No doubt this was causing them money. Depending on how copper coins were stored in or around products varies plus the type of chemicals exposed to can all have different time frames for turning.

Bob

Very valuable response. Thank you, Bob. Yes, I have definitely noticed certain dealers magically have a LOT of funny colored coins. Obviously being mass produced. When they decided to start holdering these as legitimate, they really effed up in my opinion. EVERY coin with a funny color should get the same designation. There is simply NO WAY they can decide what toning is "artificial" vs "natural." Those are their terms, not mine. All toning is corrosion!

[Petespockets55]

... Originally slabbed them in 15 then resubmitted in 19 and had them crack them out as raw. To no avail they came back with the same designation. ...

You submitted them to the same service that they were already in, and asked them to reholder them?
I can't imagine they would ever change their opinion or grade if they are re-slabbing their own. You would need to crack them out if you are sending to the same TPG and hoping for a better grade.

Rumor has it that coins submitted in the spring tend to do better because of human psyche in the spring and feeling upbeat after a gloomy winter.

[willbrooks]

.

Rumor has it that coins submitted in the spring tend to do better because of human psyche in the spring and feeling upbeat after a gloomy winter.

I've seen you make this comment before. You do realize that PCGS is in Newport Beach, CA, where, even in January the average low temperature has never been below 50°, right?

[WaterSport]

Well, If thats true - the three submissions I have in there now will get graded the end of March so I will be looking forward to better than expected grades...Not. I will say, that over the 20 years of submissions, the looseness and tightness cycles are real. They are in a VERY tight cycle right now.

Bob