Is this a chip or a die break? 1965

[twoyankees]

Found this this morning. Could any one tell me what this might be? Did the die actually come appart between the numbers or is it a worn chip or something? Thankfulness:tinysmile_classes_t Tom

[DoubleYou]

It's a die chip. Part of the die chipped out.

[1sgret]

I agree a Die Chip!

[financeman]

Definately a chip. Nice find

[cents1st]

I remember these in 1965, it is a genuine die-cud.

[mustbebob]

I remember these in 1965, it is a genuine die-cud.

It is not considered a cud. A simple crack and chip.

[cents1st]

I thought CUD is an acronym for C racked U nc D ie. Any ideas?

[mustbebob]

I don't quite know where that acronym came from. Unc Die is the first hint that it is inaccurate because dies are not uncirulated. The coins they strike are. The numismatic definition is 'When a die has a piece that has broken off, the result is a raised portion on the coin in the area of the broken die. That raised area is known as a Cud.' This always includes a portion of the rim.

[wolfkill]

:crossedlips:omg

[errorseeker928]

Most cuds appear on the rim. Can cuds also appear on profiles?

[twoyankees]

From what I understand, if a cud happpens on the reverse, away from the rim , its refered to as a retained cud. Am I correct on this?:tinysmile_classes_t Tom

[mustbebob]

That is incorrect Tom. A retained cud is one where the rim to rim die crack shows, and there is evidence of a bi-level height of the piece. The cud is still in place and hasn't broken off yet.

errorseeker, cuds include portions of the rim. they will not happen individually on the profile unless it is large enough to include the rim

[cents1st]

I remember we used the term CUD when I was in the Mint as any broken or damaged die. Breen told me (I had to look this up in my records) the term was coined by Del Ford. Ford said: A raised lump on a coin struck from a die which a piece has broken off. He was not specific as to if it had to be a rim or field or date or raised image break. I know at the Mint we used it for all of those reasons. This is fun, thanks.

[twoyankees]

I thought the Reverse was the anvil and since it does not move, the broken piece of the die remains in the die. Thats why I thought it was refered to a retained . Mabe I just misunderstood, I guess I need to read up again. :~ Tom

[mustbebob]

I think the term we need to look at is that a piece of the die has broken OFF. Normally, the only way it would break off of the die is if it was a portion of the rim.
Either way, the terminology has been used and misused forever. The way the term is seen by most people is that it does include the rim. We try to make it as universally accepted as possible, but some folks would prefer to use the term to include chips and cracks. Since those terms are already available, I don't see why the word cud would replace them.