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Sentry02
10-07-2008, 01:47 PM
I thought I would drop a line a say hello to everyone. A little about me...

I collect largely Morgan dollar VAMs with a very few Peace dollar VAMs. Everything from the big ones to the innocuous (within my measely budget of course). I'm setup here at the house with a 200X USB scope that I frequently use to attribute coins acquired from various locations.

Although most of my variety collection is Morgan-based, I have acquired some interesting varieties and mint errors over the last several years. Earlier this year I was lucky enough to get a hold of two mint error lincoln cents that were part of Leroy Van Allen's collection. Along with that I acquired 4 more of his coins, 2 Morgans, 1 quarter, and 1 very interesting nickel.

I recently added lincoln cent errors and varieties to my list and I love them. Although, I will say that a few hours of looking at Lincoln cents will make you cross-eyed. My scope helps a lot. My big reason for getting into them is that my father-in-law collects all manner of cents and he had approximately 30 rolls of 1969-1972 cent rolls from the bank that were never opened. My mother-in-law was a banker until her recent retirement.

I sent several of his coins in to NGC for attribution and more will likely follow since at least I now know I wasn't seeing things. They're in quality control, so I'm still waiting on grades, but they are 1971-Ps that were marked as VP-002. Funny thing is that they don't list VP-002 on their site, so I did some digging and finally got a hold of CS at NGC.

They told me "The associated CONECA # is 2-0-I. The Wexler-Flynn # is LCDDO-002. There is no Fivaz/Stanton # assignment".

I have a lot of the beginner guides, but haven't found a whole of information on this particular variety. I have no idea what the R&I numbers are for this variety or value potential (as I know my father-in-law will be asking me). I went to CONECA's site, but I must admit that I'm too used to reading VAM IDs as the description of it didn't seem to give me any idea on it either.

I'm sure you guys are a lot more familiar with these coins than I am and wanted to get your thoughts on them. If they're worth slabbing more, I have likely about another 15-20 that could go to NGC. I'll provide an update as soon as I get the grades for them. With any luck that will be today.

Any input is greatly appreciated and I look forward to contributing to the site as much as I can. It'll take a me a bit to get acclimated to the cents though. I have attached a few images of the lincoln errors I acquired from Leroy Van Allen (father of VAMs with George Mallis for those of you who don't know).

-Brad (Not to be confused with the Brad on the site who knows what they're talking about)

Brad
10-07-2008, 02:31 PM
Welcome Sentry...Did you check out www.lincolncentresource.com (http://www.lincolncentresource.com)? Some times people fail to realize that this exists. Anyhow, this is now the CONECA listings work: RPM stands for Repunched Mintmark, OMM stands for Over Mintmark, Doubled Dies are listed in the following way: Die Number - Obverse/Reverse - Doubled Die Class.

So 1972 Doubled Die 1, would be 1-O-I. Die 1- Obverse - Class I doubling.

You can read more about the classes here: http://www.bakercoins.net/learn/variety/ddie/index.html

Hope this helps.

1sgret
10-07-2008, 02:43 PM
Welcome to the Forum ! Joe

nightowl
10-07-2008, 02:43 PM
Welcome to the lcr sentry

OCD
10-07-2008, 02:46 PM
Welcome. Another site to visit www.coppercoins.com (http://www.coppercoins.com)

Sentry02
10-07-2008, 03:03 PM
Welcome Sentry...Did you check out www.lincolncentresource.com? (http://www.lincolncentresource.com?)

I did infact see this site. It's very well put together and assumed it was one in the same associated with this one. Where my confusion was is that the listing available fo 1971 is 1-0-II whereas NGC stated "2-0-I". Please forgive the stupid question, but am I then correct to assume then that they are the same thing just annotated in reverse? If that is the case, I am sorry I sort of wasted everyone's time with that.

Thanks a bunch for the replies. I'll see what I can dig up on values for it since I know that will be his next question for me.

-Brad

Sentry02
10-07-2008, 03:05 PM
I'll add that I didn't think the 1971 DDO listed was the same one from the www.lincolncentresource.com (http://www.lincolncentresource.com/?) page because the Wexler number on the page didn't appear to match what I was given by NGC.

-Brad

Shingpumps
10-07-2008, 03:08 PM
Welcome to the LCR

OCD
10-07-2008, 03:33 PM
I'll add that I didn't think the 1971 DDO listed was the same one from the www.lincolncentresource.com (http://www.lincolncentresource.com/?) page because the Wexler number on the page didn't appear to match what I was given by NGC.

-Brad

Try this link: http://www.coppercoins.com/lincoln/dietype.php?date=1971&die_mint=p&die_type=do&page=0

AgCollector
10-07-2008, 03:39 PM
I did infact see this site. It's very well put together and assumed it was one in the same associated with this one. Where my confusion was is that the listing available fo 1971 is 1-0-II whereas NGC stated "2-0-I". Please forgive the stupid question, but am I then correct to assume then that they are the same thing just annotated in reverse? If that is the case, I am sorry I sort of wasted everyone's time with that.

Thanks a bunch for the replies. I'll see what I can dig up on values for it since I know that will be his next question for me.

-Brad

Actually the 1971 1-O-II and 2-O-I are not the same thing, as Brad mentioned, these are CONECA designations for doubled dies. They all look like

Arabic Number - Letter - Roman Numeral

The arabic number (1, 2, 3, 4, etc) is the identity of the doubled die- each number corresponds to a different die variety.

The letter is either O or R (obverse or reverse) and indicates the side that has the doubling.

The roman numeral (I, II, III, IV, etc) indicates the class or type of doubling.

Brad
10-07-2008, 04:49 PM
NGC uses its own VP number, which stands for Variety Plus. No one except NGC uses this system.

neal
10-07-2008, 05:18 PM
Welcome to the lcr

Sentry02
10-07-2008, 05:23 PM
I appreciate the help everyone. Sorry to be such a pest with this as I am sure it can be frustrating trying to explain these things over and over again. I'll work on doing my homework before posting again...promise. :tinysmile_hmm_t:

-Brad

AgCollector
10-07-2008, 06:03 PM
I appreciate the help everyone. Sorry to be such a pest with this as I am sure it can be frustrating trying to explain these things over and over again. I'll work on doing my homework before posting again...promise. :tinysmile_hmm_t:

-Brad

Don't sweat it- ask away!

THE PENNY MAN
10-07-2008, 08:37 PM
Welcome Brad to the site and hope that you will find that we are a bunch of great people talking about what we love to collect. Happy hunting.

1sgret
10-08-2008, 01:25 AM
NGC uses its own VP number, which stands for Variety Plus. No one except NGC uses this system.

Also the company will not annotate any variety on there encapsulated coin tags if it is not on their VP List. They will grade it and send it back to you as a regular graded coin. So be sure that the coin you send in to be encapsulated as a variety is on their list. I learned the hard way.:(

amac44
10-08-2008, 07:27 AM
welcome to LCR !!!

kloccwork419
10-08-2008, 08:40 AM
Welcome!!!..Post any pix of coins you have. I like to see what I dont have.

JeanK
10-08-2008, 08:54 AM
Welcome Sentry.
You seem to be catching on quite quickly to Lincolns.
Be cautious, you might get hooked... and there is no known cure...
JeanK

RWBILLER
10-08-2008, 10:10 AM
Welcome to site
Roger

Sentry02
10-08-2008, 01:19 PM
Well, they came out of quality control today. They were all MS-65 VP-002s. Nothing special, but at least I wasn't just seeing things. Ironically enough, 1 of the coins was BB'd for improperly cleaned obverse which I laughed at since these were all from orginal mint rolls. Who knows. =-)

-Brad

Wheat Cents
10-11-2008, 06:54 PM
Welcome Sentry02

RWBILLER
10-12-2008, 12:15 PM
Have fun, good luck, the Foprum is a great place resource.
thx
Roger