1974 P with a secondary Statue, chair, and pedestal. Master Die Doubling?

[Petespockets55]

1974 P with a secondary Statue, chair, and pedestal. Master Die Doubling?




Yeah, I know this is only a 1974 but the secondary centrally located devices got my attention.
Here's an image to start with.

Secondary images on the statue and the chair seem to be to the west but the pedestal base has it to the south .... mostly. (The very bottom forms a very wide "X")

I generally look to PCGS for comparison images because they are usually pretty clear. Here's the link. https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1974-1c-rd/2971
.
When looking at the plate coin (MS68) I see similar doubling on the west side of Lincolns head. (The raised metal pointing SW, where his right ear would be.)

OK, so now I'm thinking maybe it's just master die doubling but the doubling isn't there on the other coins on the page or others when I open some auction results.

Anyways, here's some more images so so I won't be alone in my confusion.











Here are some additional links to other auctions for comparison.
https://auctions.stacksbowers.com/lots/view/3-2M6VP/1974-lincoln-cent-ms-67-rd-ngc

https://www.davidlawrence.com/product/2318643/#

https://coins.ha.com/itm/lincoln-cen...iption-071515#

After looking at these links it seems the pedestal doubling ("wide X") shows up on other examples, so the pedestal probably is Master die doubling.

For me, the images in the links aren't clear enough to determine what is causing the other doubling.

What are your thoughts? (Or maybe you are familiar with Master Die Doubling on the 1974 reverse dies and can fill me in.)
(Thanks in advance.)

[jfines69]

Very interesting... I have never seen or heard of that... Hopefully some one can chime in with some more info!!!

[WaterSport]

Even the FG looks a tad doubled??

Bob

[Petespockets55]

Jim, I hadn't either and it is easier to see in hand. Imaging closeups with the scope I have seems to change from what I see on the screen to what shows up in the file. More glare on the final product. Sigh!


Bob, It might be, but the top of the G took a "flattening hit" so I ignored it.

The doubling is fairly pronounced and I was caught off guard by seeing similar examples @ PCGS.

[mustbebob]

I think you may want to compare the area with other 1974 cents. There was a subtle change during this year and the statue and base were made with a bit more detail. There is significantly more detail than on the 1973 and previous reverses.
I did some analysis of this many decades ago. I wrote a report which never made it to print, so it is possible, I still have it somewhere.
For now, I think you could tell the differences just by comparing 1973 with 1974.

[Petespockets55]

Thank you Bob, I'll compare the two years.

I was hoping someone here had the experience to have come across the reason for it or at least have a suggestion. When the first image I compared my coins reverse to at PCGS was similar I had a feeling it might have to do with the design for the year.

Like most people I don't spend much time on 1973's because, well ... there's really not much to be found but the secondary doubling is eye-catching. The hardest part to capture in the online images for comparison was the doubling on the chair.

I think I have some BU rolls of 1973 and 1974 to compare to.

[jfines69]

Thank you Bob, I'll compare the two years.

I was hoping someone here had the experience to have come across the reason for it or at least have a suggestion. When the first image I compared my coins reverse to at PCGS was similar I had a feeling it might have to do with the design for the year.

Like most people I don't spend much time on 1973's because, well ... there's really not much to be found but the secondary doubling is eye-catching. The hardest part to capture in the online images for comparison was the doubling on the chair.

I think I have some BU rolls of 1973 and 1974 to compare to.

Let us know what you come up with!!!