Strike through VS post strike damage PSD

[onecent1909]

A struck through is when something is in between the die and the blank/planchette when it is struck.
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PSD is just that damage, a hit
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My thought is that if this struck through item stays intact
it should stop metal flow into the recesses or the design of the die.
If the item shatters then I can see at the last nano-second the metal still possibly flowing into the design.
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Put some play-doh into a mold with a chunk of metal on top in between the play-doh and the mold,
remove play-doh then remove metal
You will see no design in that area, just the impression of the struck through item
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In a previous thread (LINK) the coin in question I am still not sure that it is not just a small odd ball-pein hammer like hit at that location
post strike damage
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Just questioning if this coin has a strike through or damage...
How do you tell? damage vs strike through
Can anyone help me out understanding this?

[willbrooks]

Awesome question. For me, to answer the question, we would have to know how quickly the hammer die disengages from the striking chamber after impact, or is it launched and then allowed to carry into the planchet on its own inertia. Inertia is Newton's first law of motion. Now couple this with Newton's 3rd law: when one object exerts a force on a second object, the second object simultaneously exerts a force equal in magnitude and opposite in direction on the first object. Therefore, if the hammer die is mechanically under control thoughout the strike and retraction (which is my assumption, but I admit my ignorance of these mechanics), then we have a longitudinal wave-like "bouncing" of the force that is reintroduced into the planchet (and die) repeatedly until the die is released. I think this is what you might be saying when you are say:

If the item shatters then I can see at the last nano-second the metal still possibly flowing into the design.

However, if the hammer die is "launched" and then left to its own inertia to strike the planchet, then it would instantly recoil, like the steel balls in that swinging desk-top thingy, and the force is immediately dissipated from the planchet.
The play-dough analogy is not relevant, since your foreign metal object is harder than your play-dough die. In real coin making, most struck-through objects are less hard than a hardened steel die. That makes a big difference in your premise.

[onecent1909]

The play-doh is representing the planchette the mold is plastic and is representing the die
the chunk of metal is a hard metal strike through
if a hard metal strike through would survive the strike then
I would think the area would show no design as the metal would block the planchette metal from flowing into the die

[Maineman750]

As Will said....objects that are struck thru are likely to be as hard or almost as hard as the planchet....play-do verses a chunk of metal is not a good analogy.

[kloccwork419]

I think it would all depend on what it's being struck through.

[jfines69]

I believe I can see what OneCent is asking... In a strike thru in areas where there are devices the image from the die face would not be transfered onto or into the planchet if the item that is struck thru is harder than the planchet material... Am I on the correct path yet???

[kloccwork419]

Not necessarily harder than the planchet. It can be struck through cloth and destroy a design or still show it . Depends on how the planchet wants to flow during the strike. Just like Will is explaining above.
Gotta keep in mind that nobody knows what is really being struck through without having the piece intact with the coin or working at the mint.. Its a guess. Sometimes a delamination looks like its struck through but even when the piece is removed ,most of the time, it still shows a sign of the design that was struck. To me a delamination is like a being struck through that laminated piece of planchet which is the same hardness. Not sure if I sound like what I'm trying to explain...someone might get it..lol..Ignore me if not..lol

BTW..wheres that Kennedy?

[GrumpyEd]

"How do you tell? damage vs strike through"

The main thing I look for is that damage will often have a crater effect, some raised metal around the damage or at one end if it was a sliding gash.
If something is struck through then it has the die there so no metal can raise anyplace around the struck through area.

[GrumpyEd]

Just adding...
I saw the other thread and that coin has no raising around the area like a hit so it would be a lamination or struck through. It does not look like damage.