Varieties and values

[popowitz]

Hey Bob, Thanks for your input, it's been an informative discussion. Although I am new to cent varieties I did want to comment. I have been both the beneficiary of coin knowledge, cherry picking VAM Morgan's, and lack thereof, buying a fake 09 S VDB I also recently avoided buying a fake morgan cc that had a dealer fooled. Therefore the value of a slab isn't just the cost associated with the process, especially for a newbie like me. Ebay can have some great deals, but consider that you are paying the most for a particular coin with the highest bid of all ebay users. Back when I was green I purchase quite a few "unopened" rolls where the only good coins are on the end, and had a $100 roll package get slit open (delivered empty), for which I took the loss. Coppercoins is helpful in listing the more valuable varieties to make hunting more convenient and manageable. It will be nice to purchase coins from trusted source like this group. Thanks again, Greg PS, I am the originator of the RPM Fiasco!

Are you kidding me Sean? This hasn't been discussed here a million times before? This post seems to be a result of the 1968 RPM fiasco.

I will refuse to get involved in this conversation again, especially with the same people it has been discussed with before.

How about I put this on the home page:

DO NOT USE THE PRICING ON COPPERCOINS FOR ANY REASON. IT IS INACCURATE AND STARTS FIGHTS AND DISAGREEMENTS. IT IS ONLY THERE TO TAKE UP EXCESS SPACE BECAUSE THE ATTRIBUTER HAS NOTHING BUT TIME ON HIS HANDS AND LIKES ADDING RANDOM NUMBERS TO LISTINGS.

This is crazy folks. QUITE FRANKLY, I AM TIRED OF REPEATING MYSELF.

Tell you what. If you are so concerned about the pricing anywhere, take the time to write and publish your own book, and list the appropriate, up to date prices on each of the 5,000 + known varieties. Keep it updated and accurate at ALL times. Do not use a caveat either. Tell folks that they must abide by your prices, and that there can not be any disparity.

It is stuff like this that will eventually get me to leave this forum. Have your conversation, but leave me out of it.

[jallengomez]

Popowitz-Welcome to the LCR. You bring up a point good point by saying that you can glance at a place like Coppercoins for listing the more valuable varieties. That's very true and a good point, but even that comes with a caveat. There is certainly the boldness of the variety that plays a factor in pricing the more valuable varieties and that drives demand, but with some of the higher dollar coins, the pricing itself is driven by the "lists". Sink your teethe into a high dollar coin because it's listed in The Cherry Picker's Guide, and you may very well be sitting on a lump of coal some day when it gets taken out of that list.

[seal006]

Greg, it really does not have anything to do with you. Please do not feel that it is. I looked at the coin you showed. I saw it was one that I needed. I looked it up on CC and in the CPG. Knowing that these are not always accurate, I went to Teletrade. I looked at the last few that had been sold for the most recent info. I eliminated the two that were MS Red examples as this one you have is not red. I then saw you were thanking Will for making your first $1 on a coin that cost you a penny. That is when I made the remark of offering you $3. If I had done it in private, some would say I was trying to take advantage of you. Feeling comfortable in the info I had come by was the reason I did it publicly. I will never make that mistake again. Then to be told by not one, but two members that what I offered was insane, I showed the resources from which I derived at that figure. The thing that makes me chuckle most about this is that the two that think I am crazy for offering a mere $3 have not bothered to show why they think it is worth more. At least I took the time to explain my position.

[cimperialis]

Thanks again, Greg PS, I am the originator of the RPM Fiasco!

Didn't think your first post would have such a huge impact on the forum, did you?

[eaxtellcoin]

Wow i'm not even getting involved in this thread. Sean, you know where my site is. open it up, on the left side click on varieties already sold. It will give you the prices of what I've sold over the last two years.

[seal006]

Thanks Eric. I have done that as well. Brian Ribar's site is a good resource for that as well.

[mustbebob]

Popowitz, I am only replying in this thread because of your post. This really is about two things, your coin, and price guides. Where I agree with many statements made here, my point is that this is an ongoing subject in the forum. We discuss price guides almost every week.
A point was made to address specific coins from the coppercoins price guides with specific price info (1972 DDO-001 and 1953D RPM-001). In making those statements, coppercoins was effectively isolated as the source of the problem when he made his comparisons. Although to me this is unfair, that is his prerogative.
However, my interest to you is that your 1968 RPM is quite a find. For those of us who have been in the business for many decades, the $3 offer was unfair to a newbie. Now all of a sudden there is a in-depth study underway to determine an accurate price. I didn't know if the offer was sarcasm, serious, jovial or what. We do not know how much knowledge you have on accurate grading or pricing of these coins. I really didn't see where you were even offering it for sale. We want our newbies to feel comfortable with the atmosphere and knowledge of our membership here. We have incredibly gifted numismatists here, and everyone has something to offer. I apologize if this turned out to be overwhelming, but our intentions are honorable.

[ray_parkhurst]

So as you can see, there can be quite a range in a given week, let alone an extended period of time due to so many factors influencing the market.

Actually, it looks extremely stable to me. Over a 3 year period the range was only 5.2-6.6. Oh that we could have that much precision in variety pricing.

[jallengomez]

Actually, it looks extremely stable to me. Over a 3 year period the range was only 5.2-6.6. Oh that we could have that much precision in variety pricing.

Sure. That's the chart I happened to be looking at when I thought of the comparison. Just like this pair, some varieties are more stable than others. We could look at some of the Yen crosses and get a much wider range over the period of a couple of years. Regardless, based upon that range, give me a value that will do me any good much past...oh...right now. And if trading standard lots in the forex market, that seemingly small range can mean big, big bucks either in profit or loss.

[seal006]

Hey Jody, see if you can find a graphic that charts the value of Jesus found in Cheetos.

[jallengomez]

No can do. That's Simon's area of expertise.

[simonm]

No can do. That's Simon's area of expertise.

As this SHOCKING graph indicates...

[SDP73]

I'm no expert. Let me start off with that. But an MS65 (insert date/MM) that is the FIRST coin in an "MS65 collection" has FAR less value than the exact same coin that is the LAST coin needed to complete the same collection.

Buyers are all over the place. Sellers are all over the place. It's all chaos to me. I see coins on eBay sell for, let's say, $8 and the same coin sell for $13 two hours or two days later...not much of a difference in dollars per se, but that difference represents a 38.5% difference on price for the same item.

When you get this all figured out, write a book, sign a copy and mail it to me. I'll pay top dollar for it...of course someone else might only pay retail for it, but I digress.

[seal006]

As this SHOCKING graph indicates...

Thanks Simon. I needed that.

[jallengomez]

Steve-I've literally had auctions end with no bids at .99 cents only to then toss them back up for one more day and have them hit $5-$10 bucks the next day with multiple bids.