Rainbows

[Petespockets55]

PVC damage usually starts as shiny greenish looking stuff, but generally PVC will be soft, whereas Mylar tends to be more brittle. I know that they quit making "Mylar" a while back, but the newer cardboard flips are made of the same basic stuff as Mylar....and it is still safe for coins.

Good stuff to know.
This might be a ridiculous question but where would the coins pick up the PVC damage? In the really old flips?

[Maineman750]

Good stuff to know.
This might be a ridiculous question but where would the coins pick up the PVC damage? In the really old flips?

Anything "vinyl" they made the soft flips and 2x2 holders out of vinyl back then

[Petespockets55]

Others here may be familiar with this site on toning (Morgans- Natural and Artificial toning) but there is some fantastic information here on causes and effects as well as examples of silver. http://www.jhonecash.com/coins/tonedmorgans.asp .

[TJ1952]

I had what I thought was a couple of great wheat toners. So I submitted them. They came back MS60 recolored and detailed! They were even in my albums for 40+ years. Never cleaned or tampered with, "at least not by me anyway".

[makecents]

Very nice toners!! They are huge in the Morgan world. I have seen them go for 5, 6 times and even more there normal worth in some cases. I would assume the Lincoln is similar.

[jfines69]

Others here may be familiar with this site on toning (Morgans- Natural and Artificial toning) but there is some fantastic information here on causes and effects as well as examples of silver. http://www.jhonecash.com/coins/tonedmorgans.asp .

Those are awesome toners... At those prices I would want it in a slab and identified as a legitimate toner!!!

[jfines69]

Very nice toners!! They are huge in the Morgan world. I have seen them go for 5, 6 times and even more there normal worth in some cases. I would assume the Lincoln is similar.

A good toning can increase the value... It all really depends on the buyers likes... If I bought coins any toned ones would have to be slabbed and verified as legitimate toning to pay extra for!!!

[willbrooks]

A good toning can increase the value... It all really depends on the buyers likes... If I bought coins any toned ones would have to be slabbed and verified as legitimate toning to pay extra for!!!

I have an absoultely serious question (for everyone about this). What exactly is "legitimate toning?" Do you mean unintentional toning vs. intentional toning? All toning is corrosion, so is it only if it is unintentional that most people think it is ok? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I understand that some toners are very attractive and people find them desirable, but I guess my question is, why does it matter to people how the toning was achieved? I'm asking this seriously because an understanding of this mentality escapes me.

[Maineman750]

What exactly is "legitimate toning?" .

No such thing.....even the people deciding what is legit cannot give you a definitive answer other than some vague answer that cannot be proven.

[makecents]

I have an absoultely serious question (for everyone about this). What exactly is "legitimate toning?" Do you mean unintentional toning vs. intentional toning? All toning is corrosion, so is it only if it is unintentional that most people think it is ok? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I understand that some toners are very attractive and people find them desirable, but I guess my question is, why does it matter to people how the toning was achieved? I'm asking this seriously because an understanding of this mentality escapes me.

http://www.ebay.com/gds/Toned-Error-Coins-BEWARE-/10000000004589344/g.html

[Petespockets55]

There was a lot of technical information to digest but if I remember the article correctly the AT is almost resting on the surface and more easily removed/damaged with minimal effort or contact. Whereas the NT is more of a chemical bond between the sulphur or chemical and the silver and is more durable.With NT the different hues tend to show on the same vertical areas of the devices. (tops of devices, base or fields).

In my mind, for individual preference, they might almost be compared to natural silver vs. colorized coins. Or painted ceramics vs. glazed/fired ceramics.
Different strokes for different folks!
ps. The only time I preferred painted ceramics was when they were made by my kids!

[Petespockets55]

http://www.ebay.com/gds/Toned-Error-...4589344/g.html

Jon, nothing happens because an Ebay Error message comes up.

[Maineman750]

http://www.ebay.com/gds/Toned-Error-...4589344/g.html

Good example of what I said above

[GrumpyEd]

I have an absoultely serious question (for everyone about this). What exactly is "legitimate toning?" Do you mean unintentional toning vs. intentional toning? All toning is corrosion, so is it only if it is unintentional that most people think it is ok? The whole thing makes no sense to me. I understand that some toners are very attractive and people find them desirable, but I guess my question is, why does it matter to people how the toning was achieved? I'm asking this seriously because an understanding of this mentality escapes me.

There is no universal answer.
To me it means that a TPG would accept it and not call it AT "artificial toning".
Supposedly they have a criteria of telling by color progression and things but of course their opinion of the same coin could change if it was sent in a few times.
To many people AT means enhanced by something, heat or chemicals or paper or sunlight that speeds up the toning.
I agree, if someone wraps it in a high sulfur yellow envelope and puts it on a hot window sill or water heater that speeds it up and is intentional but not much different than by chance putting it in the same yellow envelope and having a hot apartment where it tones. In reality TPGs may or may not know the difference by looking at it.
Albums can be similar, sulfur in the cardboard can make a nice bullseye toning patter. Certain holders like old PCI holders are known for making SAEs become amazing toners. The term intentional makes sense as for as what was done but the result may or not be the same as natural, I think the key thing is how long it took. My disclaimer is, natural toning can come fast on some coins like if you have a hole in a mylar flip, it can make that coin get a spot pretty fast.

I once had a dipped scratched Franklin, wrapped it in yellow paper on my window sill and in a few months it was an amazing toner. I showed it to dealers at a show and they loved it, I told them it was a dipped out ugly coin and sold it for melt but they could not tell.
I had state quarters in a cheap folder, half of them toned fast, mostly the ones near the edges of the pages.

To me, I prefer a mint state color not toned. I look at it as all coins can become toners but toned coins can't be returned to original color unless they are stripped and that is not original. Like having your face covered by a tattoo, any face can be done but once done it won't go back to normal. I admit, there is moon money in toners and people make money on them but I am not into it myself.
I get mad when I see cents that I had slabbed in mint state red in ANACs holders and a lot of them toned or turned blue very fast.

With slabs, that first year matters a lot. My theory is if you slab a cent soon after it came from a roll they are more reactive and tend to tone crazy in the slab, if you let it tone slightly like wait a year to slab it, they do better. The safest slabbed red cent is one that has been in a slab a few years and still looks normal full red.

[makecents]

Jon, nothing happens because an Ebay Error message comes up.

Not sure what happened there, I tried to go back and find again but to no avail. It was an interesting read but it did kind of lead back to what Roger said...