Acetone On Cents

[erex01]

I had never used Acetone to "clean up" coins until recently. I have used 10% alcohol and distilled water but never acetone. I'm always concerned about the chemicals that we introduce into our water supply, a little bit can go a long way. I hope everyone is conscious of that fact. For example,one quart of oil can contaminate up to a quarter million gallons of drinking water or cause an oil slick almost 2 acres in size. Much of our water is contaminated with cosmetics but that's a different story too.
Back to acetone, sorry for my "rant". LOL I had heard Acetone works on the black spots & gunk on copper and it did but I'm concerned with what happens to the coin after a length of time exposed to air. Of course I wouldn't soak a coin that I wanted to have graded. I've heard from another site that your coin will turn a variation of colors, not at first but after it sits for a while, I don't have any experience on this.
I did locate an interesting site on the effects of acetone on copper: http://www.stonybrook.edu/vescalab/r...research7.html I understand the soak is only from 10 to 30 minutes & not longer but again, what happens to the coin after time passes? Does it turn funky colors as another site suggested?
I am also interested in identifying altered coins. For example, when you heat a coin to high temperatures, it turns an interesting red color. I wrapped a cent in tin-foil, then placed it in the oven with my lasagna, LOL and it turned silver. I tried it another time, same thing and it didn't turn silver? Not sure why? We've all seen folks using their own "home remedies", how may have you bought? You many not know until you go to get it graded right? That would stink big time...

In any case, I was wondering what happens to a coin if left in Acetone too long so I put 2 copper and 2 coated zinc coins in 100% acetone for 17 hours. I didn't notice anything really funky, although there were cleaner. Later, I read about how they would change colors after a period of time. I didn't save my "experiment" coins, just rinsed them and back to the bank they went but, I was wondering if anyone has noticed acetone soaked coins after a period of time?
Understand that this is in NO WAY to deceive anyone, I just want to be able to identify altered coins when I see them. I must admit, I have a reasonable amount of education in physics & the sciences and it just interests me. I read this in some literature a while back that the best way to identify altered coins is to see for yourself. For example, I remember a few years ago, some company came out with a product that "tones" silver, making them pretty colors. I saw a guy on eBay who was selling these coins but he didn't mention his alterations in the ad. I'm sure that is what he was doing as almost every coin in his auctions was toned. I don't remember if I emailed him or just "wanted to" email him and ask how many silver coins he had ruined? Whatever, to each is their own right...It's his coin..

Question? Have you done any of these tests? What were the outcomes or what do you see sellers trying to deceive? Have you ever sent a coin to be graded just to find out someone ruined your coin prior to you owning it? How can you really tell if you're buying raw coins? I understand the only way to really know is to buy graded but we all know that's not always the case.
Well, back to coin hunting, take care all and please remember, whatever we dump down our drains will end up in our drinking water and our water is rather important. Don't rely on the "scientists" to fix our indiscretions, sometimes it just can't be undone. I'm not suggesting that we not use Acetone, I'm only suggesting we use it safe, sparingly & with proper disposal.

[jallengomez]

I have never seen any adverse effects from the use of pure acetone, and I've soaked them anywhere from a few minutes, to overnight. That experience is limited to business strikes. I've never used it on proof strikes, but I imagine the results would be the same.

As far as heat goes, this is a common method for artificially toning coins, especially proof strikes. Generally the toning is "shallow" and has no depth and will present as an overall grey look when tilted in the light. That being said, when it comes to toned coins, I always say collect what you like. All toning is a reaction of the coins surface to the environment, so the "AT" vs "NT" debate is an ironic and humorous one in my opinion.

[Maineman750]

Actually, we have had many discussions on acetone right here http://www.lincolncentforum.com/foru...p-Conservation

In my experience, I use acetone quite a bit, especially on BU coins I find while searching bags and rolls. I rinse them to remove the oily residue that leads to fingerprints. I have also soaked some and found that zinc coated coins will change color after a while...coppers not so much. I can also tell you I have had coins slabbed by PCGS that were rinsed in acetone and they were never flagged....one of them was a 1999 WAM grading MS65, the other was a 1972 DDO#4 that graded AU58.

[enamel7]

It won't hurt them, as long as you rinse them with distilled water. Just make sure you use pure acetone. Nail polish remover will cause adverse effects.

[jfines69]

I have forgotten about coins in acetone for over a week with no ill side effects to the coin with no ill side effects to the coin that I could tell... I would not use acetone while using a candle for lighting tho as that could cause some serious side effects

[GrumpyEd]

The terminology "cleaned" with coins does not include acetone, a cleaned coin really means improperly cleaned and water, alcohol, acetone baths aren't improper cleaning as long as you get any residue off and make no lines wiping it.
Dipping coins in chemical dips is another thing and not related (like MS70 or ezest or whatever coin dips are used) acetone is a solvent so it's not like the things that take a surface layer off of a coin.

Acetone or alcohol might get some gunk off of a coin but things like green or black hard spots will not be removed.

Acetone probably is nothing like oil to the environment because acetone evaporates fast, it might leave a tiny bit of something behind when it evaporates but the vast percentage is evaporated, no idea of the real effect to ecology.

[erex01]

Ed, It's good to know "The terminology "cleaned" with coins does not include acetone" as I've often wondered about that. I thought rather afraid to wash coins in distilled water and alcohol. I wondered if I would be able to send something in for grading, I really didn't know so thanks.
Yes, Jfines69, Acetone is very thermally volatile, I'm one of those guys who reads MSDS sheets. LOL and yes, I didn't buy nail polish remover. I actually can't stand the smell of it when the wife uses it. One of the reasons I hadn't used acetone before. I now use my acetone in my garage, I don't attempt to smell it but so far I actually haven't noticed a strong smell. It is "pure acetone" from the hardware store. I actually thought it would do more than it does so I'm not worrying too much about ruining the coin with it. Again, I used to wonder if my 10 minute alcohol & distilled water soak was too much for them, now I know.

[Maineman750]

Again, I used to wonder if my 10 minute alcohol & distilled water soak was too much for them, now I know.

Keep in mind that nobody is advocating alcohol for soaking your coins. Only pure acetone or distilled water. Sorry....I just noticed that GrumpyEd did just that. I've never heard of it so I'll stick with acetone and distilled water because our resident chemist (BadThad) has verified it's safety.

[erex01]

LOL, You've never heard of cleaning organic oils using denatured alcohol?
Thats okay, we all learn something everyday.

[GrumpyEd]

Keep in mind that nobody is advocating alcohol for soaking your coins. Only pure acetone or distilled water. Sorry....I just noticed that GrumpyEd did just that. I've never heard of it so I'll stick with acetone and distilled water because our resident chemist (BadThad) has verified it's safety.

Not advocating water or alcohol, just saying that a soak or dip in them wouldn't be enough to make a coin deemed "cleaned" by a TPG. They also won't do much to help the coin unless it's something that easily washes off.

[erex01]

Good points jallengomez, you are correct that any toning is the resulting of some sort of environmental damage whether it be AT or NT. It just happens to sometimes be attractive. I personally don't care for AT, to me, If you create it, you've altered the coin in a negative way. To each is their own right? A true artist could draw a masterpiece of art on a coin but I still wouldn't be very interested. I see some people collect painted coins and that's okay, just not for me.
As far as the acetone, I don't recall saying anyone shouldn't use it as I didn't know. I just like conservative methods of washing the "tiny critters" from coins. If it works, great. I was under the false impression that a coin soaked in Acetone could not be graded. My mistake...

[Maineman750]

LOL, You've never heard of cleaning organic oils using denatured alcohol?
Thats okay, we all learn something everyday.

I've heard of it .....however, it has not been deemed safe by our resident chemist....if you check some of the threads I posted, you'll understand why

[erex01]

Maineman750 - "if you check some of the threads I posted, you'll understand why"

Am I searching these forums incorrectly? I searched several forums for information about alcohol. I used the "Enter search criteria here" box above. I searched, acetone, alcohol, cleaning coins etc. but didn't locate anything stating the “drawbacks” of using it.

I then used my “site-keyword-trick” using Google, site:lincolncentforum.com Badthad alcohol & site:lincolncentforum.com MaineMan750 alcohol “WOW, have I gotten an education on copper chemistry” LOL and you have a LOT of posts out there . LOL

I did find an archived post at: http://www.lincolncentforum.com/foru...p/t-12837.html
Discussing Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) and hot running water and dishsoap then Acetone and xylene and rubbing, (for non-expensive coins).

I also found at: http://www.lincolncentforum.com/foru...p/t-30582.html
For copper, I've found xylene is superior to acetone. Most of the tar-like, organic residues found on cents dissolve much better in a non-polar solvent.....like dissolves like. Another advantage of xylene, it doesn't need anti-oxidants or stabilizers, so it's consistently free of anything that could damage metals. It's a simply hydrocarbon mixture.

It really doesn’t matter although I didn’t see where it would be a mistake to use alcohol, although I could be wrong? I did find several other members who do the same as I had done.

Several years ago, I wanted to preserve a few coins using a very conservative approach. I didn’t want my coins to appear burnished so I began with only distilled water. Then for more aggressive removal techniques, I started using denatured alcohol. A lot of this reason was to remove and prevent fingerprints & contaminates but also any viruses or bacteria that I did not want to come into contact with. I worked at 3 hospitals over the years and yes, I’m a rather germaphobe. Also, I’ve read this in several articles, I believe I began using denatured alcohol on coins after reading a Scott Travers Book, ISBN 0-609-80746-3 “Page 47?” where he states: “it’s a good idea to neutralize or degrease your coins before long-term storage, using denatured alcohol.”
I believe alcohol is less aggressive than acetone. Either of which should be used only for bare minimum amounts of time.

Regardless, a person needs to recognize their own limitations.

My personal opinion is that Alcohol is much safer and evaporates completely and quickly (although still very flammable but less harsh fumes and less irritating to skin/eyes) so, I’m not so afraid to use it inside. (acetone I‘ve been using in my garage)

Having said all that, I did get an education on these chemicals. I’m now leaning towards xylene over acetone for the reasons BradThad suggested above as well as it giving more controlled results.

Thanks again, I'm sure you and I can agree this is a "dead-horse". LOL
Have a Great Day & Good Luck in your searches....